Curse

Loch · Nov 11, 2005, 05:27 PM // 17:27

I posted this before, and I'll post it here:

I just played through Grenth's Footprint and Sorrow's Furnace as a Fire Elementalist with mostly AoE spells. Firestorm, Meteor (but not shower), Fireball, Incendiary Bonds were all on my skillbar.

Holy crap, PvE is fun again. Considering how I was using a full henchgroup, that's saying a lot.

The whole thing just felt dynamic. Enemies ran to protect themselves. This alone opened up SO many doors to the game. Warriors have a reason to bring Hamstring, rangers have a reason to bring Pin Down, eles have a reason to pack water spells. Oh, and rangers can actually trap without Mantra of Resolve! That's right, trap up the area, then unload Fireball. More than likely, fleeing enemies will cripple themselves trying to escape.

And instead of explaining the last benefit of this, I'll post a quote from the Library of Wisdom on the Importance of Positioning:

Quote:

Now, another little known fact is that when a character is running any hit delivered to them will be a critical hit. When being beaten on by a Warrior or a Ranger often the worst move you can make is to turn and run to get away from them. You're just opening yourself up to a lot of pain.

Adapt. Have fun.

delfin42 · Nov 11, 2005, 05:28 PM // 17:28

I don't believe in online petitions, but this is one that I would sign.

super dooper · Nov 11, 2005, 05:33 PM // 17:33

/signed, 80 times over if I could.

griffons react differently to the AoE's than hydras I guess? Hydras will run, but they come back even before Balthazar's Aura ends, it shouldn't be your only killing skill anyway :P

Sir Skullcrasher · Nov 11, 2005, 06:12 PM // 18:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by derrtyboy69

Anet is really godamn stupid. Now that people cant farm many people are going to leave the game. This happned with every time they nerfed a skill, and nerfed UW farming. Theyre killing the game so fast no one will be around to buy chapter 2

No to flame anyone here.. but is Guild Wars all about farming?

I mean (not being angry at farmer.. cuz i am one) but all those people that farm is either wealthy and has tons of gold in their stock. Or have the best weapons and armors set. While some low level non-farming people are stuck with their old armors and non-"Godly" weapons. Is this patch doing any godo for the community yes and no. On the yes part, it remove the ability for farmer to used AoE spells to kill enemies. On the no part, it alienate people from using elementlist without changing their skill set. Its not a bad patch but it remove elementlist from being the force to be reckon with. But think about it, by making the AI smarter (moving away from AoE spells) it make the PvE side longer and more challenging for us.

Stayfrosty · Nov 11, 2005, 06:36 PM // 18:36

Ohhhh and just to clarify.. I am a long time griffon farmer and I am sill happily farming away as a W/n only thing that I do differently is that I have to do 2 groups instead of 1 big group. My speed of killing didnt go down at all about 3 min per group.

entropy · Nov 11, 2005, 06:38 PM // 18:38

yes it did stay. I mean if its 2 groups 3 min each then thats 6 minutes compared to the regular 3. Your farming rate just dropped by 50%.

Lord Zado · Nov 11, 2005, 06:56 PM // 18:56

Yeah and 6 minutes to make 800-1200 gold on an average run (and a lot more if a good item drops) is unreasonable? Give me a break!

Glaekenjz · Nov 11, 2005, 07:05 PM // 19:05

/sign

aron searle · Nov 11, 2005, 07:06 PM // 19:06

I dont like this patch so no.

BUT ill say what ive already said.

**Even if you like this update in principle the current state of it is FAR to buggy, take it away and bring it back when its done**

(some problems include / 1 shot AOE spells causing them to flee / henchie management with orion, he cast fireball and they run but the henches follow, very bad agro management).

id0l · Nov 11, 2005, 07:22 PM // 19:22

13 signitures for the patch, 351 and counting against it. You do the math.

Rancour · Nov 11, 2005, 07:25 PM // 19:25

I must admit, I got pretty p***ed when I discovered that the Griffons started running away from me when I used my Balthazar's Aura. Very annoying. But in a way it's ok, cause there will ALWAYS be a way to counter the enemies, even if they run away, so it's ok with me. But only just...

However, I COMPLETELY fail to see why farming is a bad thing. Why can't people be insanely rich? They don't stop others from doing the same and they aren't ruining the game for others. If people go "Oh, well with insanely rich people, the prices of good weapons will go sky-high!" I say "And...?".
Remember, them farming alot doesn't prevent you from doing it and it's really very easy. Also, farming will bring in more than enough good items for you to use so don't complain that the good items cost alot; you can find them yourself. Also, is everyone forgetting green items? Get to Deldrimor Warcamp and find some superb weapons all by yourself with a couple of guildes. No problem. Collectors are good too.

Now, then people will ask what we need all the money for. EASY. We need them for armor. With the new patch, Fissure armor and even 15k armor will be ridiculously hard to get for people who joined after this patch, even impossible for many.

I'm all for increased AI. But not when it's at the expence of money making. Weapons are easy for everyone to get, with greens and collector items floating around. Armor is another matter. The prices of armor won't reach the extremes, since players can't trade armor with others.

What this patch did to the economy, was to make the weapons that are ridiculously easy to get, slightly harder to get, while making the armors that were hard to get, insanely hard to get.

To me that doesn't sound like a good patch. However, making it harder for players to do PvE (PvE quests/missions, not farming) was a great plus. The game was very easy to complete and I'm all for making it harder. But not at the expence of farming.

I'm not sure how to fix the problem, but I'd suggest making the increased AI only apply to quests and mission. As in, if you have ANYTHING in you quest log, enemies will run form AoE, but if you're not hired for anything, they'll be as dumb as always.

/signed, but it definately requires some changing in my opinion.

GWGuru · Nov 11, 2005, 07:29 PM // 19:29

Quote:

Originally Posted by entropy

yes it did stay. I mean if its 2 groups 3 min each then thats 6 minutes compared to the regular 3. Your farming rate just dropped by 50%.

In Afghanistan a man making 7 dollars a week is significantly better off than the rest of his country....the point is that Time/Gold isn't relevant. What IS relevant is what you have compared to the rest of the community. With the recent changes far less people will be farming, prices will go up on items, and the peolpe that ARE farming will continue to make the same amount of gold they were making before the patch regardless of the fact that it takes more time to do it....of course none of this matters since the patch didn't kill farming in the first place.

Mahanaxar · Nov 11, 2005, 07:38 PM // 19:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by id0l

13 signitures for the patch, 351 and counting against it. You do the math.

Owned?

I dont wanna talk about pve fun, new adaptive builds, chinese farming slaves, ebayers and so on.
But all these farming nerfs are unfair for all the *honest* farmers that wanna buy a fow armor or other expensive things, just for the fun of it.

And I'm sure most of the ppl that now are posting "yeah great job, keep it up" bought their fow armor months ago and now cannot care less about this update, but support it just to look uber&pro.

Come on, be serious: am I supposed to need 2 minutes to kill every single group? I'm reading some funny suggestion like traps around the mob, crippling skills to make they stay close. Yeah, this can be funny one or two times, but what about long missions like THK, Hells Precipe, the Wilds? The real challenge will be to complete them with the whole group, because every single pve thing will be utterly boring.

Eet GnomeSmasher · Nov 11, 2005, 07:42 PM // 19:42

Count me in as FOR the patch.

Oh by the way, it's much easier to get signatures from people pissed off about something than people who are content and don't even think about the so called issue...

mishop · Nov 11, 2005, 07:43 PM // 19:43

I really really hope Anet does not undo this change because I've seen these threads before in other games.

- Anyone who remembers AC1 remebers all the threads screaming about keeping bots, making spells easier to cast, etc. Now that game is dead.

- Anyone who remembers Planetside remebers the calls for stronger weapons for the 'experienced players'. Game is now dead.

There are many examples.

Any game that listens to these complaints and responds will end up with a game with no challange, and that game will die.

Players will ask for the game to be easier for them, then they will get bored and quit.

You need a game to keep challenging you, keep you adapting, keep you off balance. Otherwise, you will get bored and move on.

This is not in the best interest of even the farmers, as they need large populations of players to sell things to.

If this patch gets removed because of players complaining that it makes the game harder for them, take it as a sure sign that the game is on the road to inevitable death.

The only way for Anet to survive is to continue to tweak and challnge and completely ignore any complaint, petition, remark or anything else that begs to make the game status quo.

Don't do it. Make it harder. Keep nerfing. Make players adapt and change. The game depends on it.

828168 · Nov 11, 2005, 07:44 PM // 19:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by qwe4rty

I hear a lot about how easy PvE is, and that its a joke. When they finally make it a bit more difficult, everyone complains.... Make up your minds. I support the patch, but it could be slightly tweaked. I hafn't actually gone online yet, but from what I hear, the first sniff of AoE sends them running. Maybe allow them to take X dmg, or X rounds of AoE dmg b4 running?

The best way to make it more difficult shouldn't be to make them run like chickens in a farm. It's hilarious seeing them run. And I've spent more time laughing than trying to deal damage since Eles are almost useless. I saw Air at work and it was funny and slow. I converted to Water and it's slow and weak too. I've seen warriors playing tag. OMG. This is so funny. Great job ANET! I am now just laughing because I have no reason to save for that Rago's staff anymore. I got myself the best weapon an Water Ele can use... Now to figure out how to use my water spells to make a walk from Beacon's to Droknar. Yes, walk... Why run when they run from you? Just gotta form the right party and you might be able to walk there. lol.

Rancour · Nov 11, 2005, 07:48 PM // 19:48

Alright, I give in. Just went Griffon Farming again and even if it goes alot slower and is a little more tedious, it can still be done without any major problems.

/signed

Loviatar · Nov 11, 2005, 08:10 PM // 20:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rancour

I

Now, then people will ask what we need all the money for. EASY. We need them for armor. With the new patch, Fissure armor and even 15k armor will be ridiculously hard to get for people who joined after this patch, even impossible for many.

I'm all for increased AI. But not when it's at the expence of money making. .

first off i am a fire ele so i am one of the ones smacked.

second those are cosmetic long term grind items.

thirdly it made no sense for them to stand there til they died.

fourthly i think there are many things which could be done to lessen the damage to skills without reducing the AI back to minus 1 and expect this to be given several major tweaks the same way faction was introduced and then given major tweaks.

GIVE THEM TIME FOR IT TO SETTLE AND GIVE THEM PLAYING DATA TO EVALUATE.

calamitykell · Nov 11, 2005, 08:13 PM // 20:13

/signed

Farin · Nov 11, 2005, 08:16 PM // 20:16

/not signed